S03E23: Mentoring in Translation

Stephen Lank

Thank you very much. I’m excited to talk to you.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Please introduce yourself to our audience and tell us what you do.

 

Stephen Lank

Okay. Well, my name is Steve Lank, and I am the CEO of Cesco Linguistic Services. It’s based in Denver, Colorado, though I work myself remotely from Washington, DC. And the company, we do a full range of translation, interpreting, and training services with an emphasis on public sector needs related to language access. And I actually just moved into the CEO role in October. So, I’m just finding my feet at the moment, but I love the challenge and it seems like a natural progression for me after 35 years working in the industry. So, I’m excited.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

How did you find yourself in this industry? Can you give us some background?

 

Stephen Lank

Sure. Well, I’ve always loved language. I started studying Spanish when I was in the seventh grade. Of course, in the US you start studying language later than in a lot of other places. But I was immediately drawn to it. I had great teachers in middle school and high school who encouraged that. And I just knew I wanted to do something with language, but I wasn’t sure what that was because there wasn’t a whole lot of talk, when I was back in school, about translation and how that worked. So, I ended up studying Spanish when I went to the University of Virginia for my undergrad. And it wasn’t really until I went to study abroad. I’ve studied in Valencia, Spain in junior year in college, where it really clicked for me that language was something that you could work with and have a career with that you could really make it a part of your life. So, after I got back from that, I hounded one of my professors into agreeing to do an independent study with me in translation. Of course, the translation part was all literary, but that’s the entrée that you have for translation, at least at the time for me back when I was studying in school. And that was great.

 

And then after school, I lit my fuse for the study of language and translation in particular. And then after graduation, I got married. My wife and I moved back to Spain, where I started to dabble. I mean, I did what most Americans do when you’re abroad. As a young person, I was teaching English. But then I started to dabble a little bit in freelance translation, really loved that. But it was just one day that at the Institute where I was teaching, I came across a brochure from the Monterey Institute of International Studies in Monterey, California. And that was the first time I’d ever seen a program that was offered for translation and interpreting studies. I didn’t realize they existed. So, I applied there. And I still have the picture of myself standing in my living room, Valencia, with my acceptance letter in my hand. So that was a big day for me. And it’s all been great from there. I’ve been working, since I went to school at the Institute, I have been working steadily in the industry since then. So, I’ve been working for 35 years. And so, I’m a lucky person, I realized, because not everybody gets to work in the field that they study. But that’s me. I’ve been able to do that.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

You know, your observations, given the amount of time that you’ve spent in this industry, and you’ve seen it from different angles, what has stood out to you as major changes and evolutions in this industry? How did it transform itself over the years?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, that’s a big question. And that’s worthy of a podcast of its own, I’d say. But you know, obviously, there’s the growing role of technology. That’s an obvious one. When I started out, we were still delivering projects via FedEx. We were looking up translators in a hard copy of the ATA directory. We were still calling people on landlines. I still remember the first email when we first got email in the company. And at that time, it was just one email address for the entire company. So, technology has done a lot to speed things along and to help the industry evolve, you know, both in good ways and bad ways, right? I mean, it’s eased a lot of things, but it’s also complicated others.

 

Now with the expectation that we’re all available 24-7, 365, that’s a little bit frustrating to deal with but technology has been a great evolution. But also, I’ve noticed that the industry has grown that we’ve evolved away a little bit, I think, from people knowing the entire project lifecycle. I think a lot of in the industry, as the industry has gotten bigger, we’ve gotten siloed translators of translators, project managers of project managers, and things like that. Not everybody really knows how things work from soup to nuts, right? And I think that’s a shame because I think that the best people that we have in the industry working are the ones who understand the thing from the beginning to end. But I see it now being corrected a bit.

 

You see more and more T&I programs that are offering tracks in project management, which I think is a nice change. And it’s certainly something that I wish that I’d had, because, you know, when I came out of school, I had my translation and interpreting skills, but I didn’t have the other skills that you need to work. But I would say, that for me, the biggest change that I’ve noticed over the years that I’ve been working is the change in the U.S. market.

 

So, in the 90s, when I was starting out to work, we were doing most of our work for export and in the usual European and Asian languages. In other words, we were helping American companies sell their products and services abroad. And then I went to Europe for eight years at the beginning of the 2000s and I came back in 2008. And when at that time, there was a big chunk of the work all of a sudden that we were doing that was being done for the consumption in the U.S. And now I would say that was probably about 50-50 at that time, but now what we’re doing in my current company is about 80-20, I would say, for domestic consumption and that’s in languages of immigration. So, these are languages that the U.S. educational system does not necessarily address. So, we have our work cut out for us there as an industry to help address the need for the languages that are required on the U.S. market at this time.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

It’s interesting, Steve, that you mentioned that at the beginning you had no clue which direction to go because this industry is so big, and it’s so little talked about that it’s hard to determine which direction you should be taking. And actually, that’s something that I wanted to talk to you about today, which is our topic of conversation for this podcast episode. I know this is very important to you, too. And you know, you always talk about this. So, Steve, please tell me what is mentorship and if you had it, how would it help you back then and why today it is needed in our industry?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, a lot of questions there built into that one. You know, for me, mentorship and teaching go together. So, you can be working one-on-one with somebody who can be working in a classroom. To me, mentorship and teaching other new professionals is all about helping these new professionals enter the industry with the skills and the knowledge that they need to succeed and to help the industry grow and to be recognized as a profession that it is. We struggle to be recognized as an industry, as a profession and so, part of mentorship is to help new professionals come in and recognize it for what it is and to succeed and to work with best practices and to follow standards and things like that, rather than just going off on their own to try to figure it out, because that’s not good for anybody. And while most programs, T&I programs, both in the US and abroad are very good at teaching and training for translation and interpreting skills, it’s the business side of things, the marketing, the market realities part, the soft skills that new and new professionals often lack and that they can only really get from people who have been working in the industry because otherwise they just stumble till they find their footing. That’s not good for the industry at large in terms of being taken seriously. Some argue, that by doing this, you’re basically training your competition, that people will say, well, we found our way on our own, we didn’t have this, they should, too. But I think that’s wrongheaded. In my mind, the pie is big. There’s a lot of work out there. And by helping others, we help ourselves. And if we model the best practices to new professionals, that is what we’ll start to see out in the world rather than the wild, wild west, anything goes mentality that we so often see.

 

And then what I always tell my students and my mentees is that if you want to be taken seriously yourself, you first have to take yourself seriously. So, if we want to be taken seriously as a profession, we have to help to ensure that those that are entering the profession know the ropes, and act accordingly. Because if we want the profession to grow and thrive, that can’t be done in a vacuum. People need help doing that, just like in other professions. We’re not any different than any other profession where people are coming in and need support. And by helping others, we’re actually helping ourselves.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

So, Steve, tell me about your own mentorship experience when you were actually learning about the business side of things. Who did you reach out to for help? What type of information did you get? Was it relevant or did you have to go to associations like Gala or some other big one in order to find the right people?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, when I was starting out, the big association was ATA, and I didn’t really know a lot about that at the time. But I was very, very fortunate to be able to attend the Monterey Institute. There are a lot of great professionals there. And I got excellent training but in terms of a mentor, I did have one. I didn’t recognize her as a mentor at the time. But looking back, I would definitely say that she was my very first boss in the industry, Valeska Ostrowski Van Fleet. She was my first boss as I said. I worked with her as an intern first when I was going to the Institute of Omega International. That was her company. And she taught me everything about the industry and the project lifecycle and managing clients and partners, the whole deal. And she insisted that I learn all the steps in the cycle, even the ones that I wasn’t responsible for, because in her mind and in mine now, it’s really the only way to be able to completely manage a project and anticipate where things might go wrong. In other words, to be proactive rather than reactive. That has served me tremendously well throughout my career. And believe me, I screwed up a lot at the beginning and I still do from time to time. You know, I’m only human. But she didn’t let that detract from her mission of moulding me into a competent PM. Coincidentally, I was also her first employee. So, she did all of this for me at a time while she was dealing with a really steep learning curve herself, but this was a small company. It was herself and her partner and me as their first employee doing all this work, so they really needed somebody who was going to be able to plug in. And I stayed there for 10 years. I ultimately became a minority partner in that company. And I’ve learned something super helpful and meaningful from every subsequent boss that I’ve had. But it really was Valeska, who was the one that gave me the solid foundation that’s allowed me to have such a long career. So, I’m really grateful to her.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Our industry is, as you know, undergoing a generational shift. There are a lot of millennials joining and they are looking for mentorship. And I believe that without passing the baton to the new generation in a systematic way, we can’t expect a smooth transition. How do you think, Steve, mentorship can play a role?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, this is exactly what mentorship is designed to do, right? It’s to bring people into the profession in a way that they can be successful and in a way that they will not only survive but thrive. And so, if they survive and thrive, so does the industry survive and thrive. And so, we owe it to ourselves and to this next generation of professionals to do that. They don’t know what they don’t know, so we have to help them. And if we want the profession to thrive and to be taken seriously, we need to make sure that the people that are entering know the ropes and know how things should be done, not just the way they would do them themselves or the way they want to do them or the way they figured it out on their own, but to follow best practices. And you can’t know what best practices are by stumbling around, right? You need support and so we owe it to ourselves and the profession to do that.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Let’s look at the role of the mentor and the mentee. What actually defines a good mentor in localization or translation? What qualities and traits must they possess in order to mentor somebody well?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think, you know, obviously you need to know your stuff, right? You need to love your job and love your work and want to pass that passion along. But I think the real key qualities in a good mentor are our openness and flexibility because if you can only see your way of doing things if it’s your way or the highway, it’s not going to work. You have to meet your mentee or your student where they are and craft your advice and instruction in a way that’s accessible to them, that they can understand and apply to their own situation. And that’s going to differ from person to person, which is the part that attracts me to mentoring and teaching. I love that challenge. I love, seeing the people that are different from myself that have a different approach to the work or a different approach just in general than I might have and figuring out ways that I can help them succeed, even though what their ultimate goals are, they might be different than mine or their approach might be different than mine. But there’s a way that you can find to help them along, to follow their own path while at the same time learning how the basics of the industry and how to navigate all the challenges. And to me, you could only do that if you’re open to seeing alternative ways and alternative perspectives about how things should be handled because just because you did something one way doesn’t mean it’s the only way to do it or the way that person’s going to be successful so what you need to do is find out what it is about that person that motivates them and makes them tick and figure out a way that you can instil that knowledge and pass on that advice to them in a way that is accessible to them.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Let’s talk about the outcomes when it comes to mentorship. What do you get out of mentorship? As a mentor, what is your goal? What do you want to achieve at the end?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, first of all, I just love helping people. I mean, I think that’s why we’re all here ultimately, is to help others. I mean, otherwise, you’re just by yourself. But I get a ton out of mentoring. I tell people it revitalizes me; it gives me oxygen to work with people who are just starting out, who are super enthusiastic about the profession. And it’s also deeply satisfying to be able to help someone and succeed in the profession. I love the industry. I love the work and I want others to love it, too. But when you’re doing your day-to-day work, I’ve been working for like a long time as I told you, 35-plus years. Sometimes you can lose track of what it is you love about the work that you do. And I think working as a mentor helps remind me of what brought me to the industry in the first place. So, there’s a lot of enthusiasm and a lot of excitement for the future and things like that that you get when you’re working with a one-man team. And sometimes there are people that are coming that are fresh and new to the industry. Sometimes there are people that are making a career change, maybe some older people that are having a career change or people that have been working in the industry that are just looking for some support or taking a new direction. So it can take many forms, I think the enthusiasm part of it that you get back from the mentee and their anticipation of what’s to come is exciting and it revives my own passion for the work that I do, because as I said, sometimes, when you’re in the thick of it like I told you, I had a computer crash this morning when you’re dealing with the day to day drudgery sometimes of what your work is, you forget sometimes what you love about your work and I think working with mentees really helps that for me.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

The purpose of knowledge is to be shared because we are collecting organisms and we do things collectively and if we don’t share and transfer that knowledge, then that’s useless knowledge, that’s basically junk. When it comes to mentorship and you’re passing on that knowledge to other people. What type of satisfaction do you get out of it?

 

Stephen Lank

What type of satisfaction do I get out of it?

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

That’s right, when you see someone actually taking your knowledge and doing something with it.

 

Stephen Lank

Oh, it’s tremendously satisfying. You know, I love to hear success stories from my former mentees who said, oh, you know, you told me this thing a while back and I did this and it worked or, you know, just to like to hear that some of the advice that you gave has actually been applied. I’ve had mentees who have been studying for a certification exam and I’ve helped them figure out ways to best study for it. And then they’ve passed. And that’s hugely satisfying. Obviously, they’re the ones that sat for the exam, but you have some connection to that. Or they’ve won new business, or they’ve been struggling to grow their business and you give them some pointers about how they might attract new business or ways, different ways of networking or things like that, things that they haven’t thought about before that have helped them grow their business. And that to me is tremendously satisfying. It’s nice to know that as a person who’s, like you said, that knowledge that’s not shared is just pointless, why do it? But some of what I do is pretty old school still. Some things just work all the time. And it’s nice to know that those things can still work and that I have younger people that I’m working with that appreciate that and can apply it and make it work for them. So that to me is tremendously satisfying.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

As a mentee, how and where should you look to find a mentor for translation and localization sector?

 

Stephen Lank

You can find a mentor anywhere, really. I mean, you just have to keep your eyes open. I think, as you go about your networking, whether that’s online or in person, you can just keep an eye out for people that you click with or who you admire or if you’re following them in some capacity on social media, you reach out to people. If you see people often enough, you can just ultimately reach out to them and talk to them and see how they might be able to help you or if they’re interested. Also, if you’re studying in a program, you reach out to a professor that you admire or somebody that you’ve seen who has been particularly helpful or whose approach to the work you appreciate, that person might be able to help you.

 

Also, there are industry organizations. Many industry organizations will be able to connect you with somebody that you could be paired with as a mentee. ATA has a wonderful program. I actually have been working and participating in that program for a number of years now, and I love it. And their program, I think they take applications for the program starting in January. I think the application process for that goes from January to March. So, I would encourage people who are interested in doing that and working with a mentor to apply to the ATA program because it can be about whatever it is that you’re looking for. You fill out this application and you tell them what it is you’re trying to improve in your practice, whether it’s language-specific, whether it’s about growing your business or what specific challenge you have. And then they will pair you with somebody based on that. And I think it’s a terrific program. So, I would encourage people to reach out to ATA for that as well.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Steve, time is a limiting factor for all of us. What value should both the mentor and the mentee associate with their time as an investment? What do they get out of it?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think just like anything else, Sultan, you get out what you put in, right? It’s best to have a goal in mind. You need to put some structure around it. I think that’s the key. You

can’t be casual about it because if you’re casual about it, then you don’t take it seriously. And then you’re both wasting each other’s time. So, I suggest that you have a goal in mind if you are looking for a mentor, you need to have a sense of what it is that you need help with and find a person and then put some structure around that and time wise, a limit, a time limit on it, at least initially to keep yourselves on track. So, in the case of the ATA program, for example, that program runs for six months and it’s up to the mentor and mentee to decide what topics they are going to address, how frequently they’re going to meet. And then there are the check-in periods throughout and then it wraps up, I think, usually from May to October and then October is when the conference typically is and then you have an opportunity to meet up with your mentee and mentor at that time. So, you need to put some structure around it, too. So again, you take it seriously and you make it a part of your schedule. And I think as a mentee, the value is obviously the expert advice that you get from a working professional. There are things that you can learn in a program, your translation and your interpreting skills, you get great training that way, but there are other things that you can only get by talking to somebody who has experience in the field. And ask those questions that you want to ask you can’t look up in a book, for example. And so, it’s like pure gold to have access to somebody who can do that for you.

 

And as a mentor, at least for me, it’s just that connection to this next generation of translator interpreter that’s exciting and invigorating for me, get a lot of satisfaction giving back. But I always end up learning something myself, particularly on the technology side. So, somebody that started back when I did back when technology was not a big part of translation yet. I mean, cat tools were just starting to come into formal use at that time. I learned a lot from my mentees about how to use technology. So, I learned something every time.

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Sultan Ghaznawi

Steve, a lot of people who have been running businesses traditionally have learned everything in an industrious manner. Although fundamentals remain the same, how can mentorship create a barrier to success in a fast-paced, technology-focused business landscape like localization today? If you look at trends, business trends in the past, everything was done in a very structured, very well-planned way. Even today, that’s happening. But we also see that technology is changing the landscape. Technology is changing the trends in such a fast-paced way that things that were relevant two days ago or a year ago are no longer relevant anymore, that technology is not relevant. People may have lost interest in that product altogether. So, someone who grew up in the 1970s or 80s learning about how to operate businesses back then, can you mentor someone today to run their businesses the way they learned how to do it? Or if you do that, does that create any type of barrier for the mentee because they are learning the old ways of doing things?

 

Stephen Lank

No, first of all, I don’t think that mentorship can ever be a barrier. I think that just the act of the two generations, the two working together, I think is always a positive thing. Technology changes and technology changes quickly. But I think the fundamentals of what we do and the fundamentals of running a business are don’t change that dramatically. I mean, technology maybe speeds some things up and changes things slightly. But I think a lot of the basics, it’s really the soft skills part of things that those things can be hard to learn, and technology is not going to help you with those. Technology can automate a lot of things. But I think just the basics, the fundamental basics of translation, localization and interpreting and running a business stay the same. So, I do think that people from my generation can be very helpful to people that are coming up and where that relationship works in both directions is on the technology part. I mean, you talk about technology with your mentee. They bring that, but they might bring that into the conversation about, here’s this new tool, what that’s new tool, what do you think about that and how can that be applied? And you talk through those things. And I think in that particular case, you know, the knowledge goes in both directions. It’s bi-directional. But I think mentorship is never a barrier. And I think it’s a way for people of my generation to learn something also from the new generation coming up about how to apply and harness technology.

 

I think that the important thing, certainly, that I always tell my students and my mentees is that technology should not be a barrier or should not look at technology as a threat to your livelihood. You should look at it as something that’s here that you can work with, that can help you in your practice and that’s something that you need to have that you need to be open to and harness. You need to run the technology, not let the technology run you.

 

The fact of the matter, for a long time, I’ve worked in standards and developing translation standards for the industry. And part of the problem that you have in standards development is similar to what you’re saying right now is that it takes a long time to develop a standard. But technology changes so fast that if you make too many references to technology inside of a standard, by the time you’re done, you’ve got to rewrite it. You just got to keep an eye on technology and know that it’s always going to be a part of the equation in this business, in this profession, but not let it dictate everything that you do.

 

So, I think the fundamentals of the work are always going to stay the same. The technology can help enhance those and how we do things and perhaps improve some processes and how we get things done. But I think that the fundamentals are the same. So, I think that the generations working together are something that enhances both careers, both the mentor and the mentee.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Steve, while we’re still talking about technology and you covered it quite well, how can you leverage technology to support and mentor people beyond what we did traditionally? As a business for example before we were just selling translation, word-for-word translation, and transformation from one language to another. But now with technology, we’ve opened doors for all kinds of different types of businesses, business models and so forth. How can we mentor people to put that to good use?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think that, as a mentor, you need to talk to people about technology and how technology can enhance your practice and help you, so not see technology as a threat, but see it as a tool. And so, any technology that can help you automate certain tasks that are repetitive, that don’t necessarily need your creative brainpower, I think that those are things that people need to be looking at so that they can apply their human brains to the things that really require that. So, I think the way that you leverage that is just to talk to people about using the tech, looking at the technology and how the technology can help them and enhance their practice. I tell people, machine technology is not machine translation. Technology is not going to take away your business, your work, your livelihood unless you let it. It’s another opportunity, people should see technology as an opportunity to offer other services or to enhance their skills, to be able to do more. So, I think it’s in the way that you look at the technology and what the technology is doing.

 

Also, to get involved in helping develop technology or enhance technology from a language and a linguistics perspective. A lot of times technology, early on, anyway, technology that we had in our industry was not necessarily designed with translators and interpreters in mind or by translators and interpreters. So, a lot of what we were seeing was imposed and we had to make do because the technology was developed without necessarily input from the industry. So, we’ve had to have some workarounds to deal with that. I would say to people, you know, get involved, see where the technology developments are happening and get involved and see how you can help have an impact on how the technology is developed.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Stepping away for a moment from the microscope, you know and talk about macro trends. Do you think our industry is doing a good job in promoting mentorship today?

 

Stephen Lank

I think we’re trying. I speak about it a lot. I have colleagues that I work with who are all very passionate about it, but I don’t think that it gets in the last few years. I’ve seen, you know, a number of initiatives and a lot of people are talking now about the talent gap and what we need to do to get people trained up to make sure that they’re entering the industry in a successful way. And I think that that’s part of the evolution of the profession. Before it was all about bringing business in and now, we’re looking at, what’s the pipeline for talent and how we’re looking more inward about how we can improve and how we can develop. I think we started to take some responsibility on ourselves as an industry to ensure that there is a pipeline of talent coming into the industry. I think in the past we haven’t done it very well. I think over the last few years I’ve seen some real trends. ALC has a program, ALEA has a program, GALA is doing a lot of work in that area, ATA, of course. I think that we haven’t always done a good job, but we’re getting better.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Today more than ever before, there is a problem with labour and talent availability in every industry, including our own. How does that put mentorship and training to the forefront of what we do as an industry in order to bring in more people to make sure that we can cope up with the volumes that are coming in, in terms of translation localization?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, that’s part of what these initiatives are that we’re seeing lately where we’re finally starting to take responsibility. We at LSPs, the LSC’s, language service companies that need the talent and even direct clients or customers who might have internal programs of their own, put a lot of pressure on academic institutions to ensure that people are trained up for us to plug directly into our program, into our businesses and be able to work right away. And that’s a little bit too much pressure. That’s not what academia was designed for, right? That practical training parts. I think that we as leaders in our industries and our companies need to take responsibility for some of this training as well. The academia, we can work with academia to help them to talk about the things that we need to see in programs that we would like to see in programs in order to make sure that these new graduates are coming out of programs with skills that we need. But then on top of that, we need to give them the practical training that they need. And that can either be through mentorship with individuals. It can be going back into the classroom and teaching as an adjunct in a program as I do and as many of my colleagues do to bring that practical experience into the classroom to give students an idea of what it’s like on the market in the real world, applying this trade, doing this work as opposed to in an academic environment.

 

And also, I think it’s very, very important that companies start to offer, either start to offer or continue to offer internships to give students practical training to get a sense of what it’s like to work in a company because you can have training in class about project management or this is what it’s like or you could to do certain things or you can put time pressure on them to do certain things or you can create these scenarios, but it’s still a scenario. And you’re still doing it within an academic environment where ultimately, if the project doesn’t work, you know, there’s no real-world consequence for it, except for perhaps you’re great in your class. But I think it’s important for students to see what it’s like in the real world to problem-solve and to work on a project and juggle deadlines and things like that. And the only way they can do that is if we help them. And so, companies need to put our money where our mouths are, because we’ve been whining for a long time about this talent gap. But it’s really contingent upon us to make to ensure that people have the skills that they need to enter our companies. And they can’t get that unless we give them that experience ourselves because you can recreate parts of it in an academic environment, but you can’t really recreate the whole thing. So, I think that companies need to do a better job of of stepping up and offering those opportunities to students.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

What is the role of the associations? I know you talked about this earlier and professional groups in the language industry. I mean, ATA has been active. Woman localization has been pretty active in terms of mentorship. Are there other associations, other groups that could be helping in facilitating mentorship and connecting people in order to get their skills up to speed?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think that all associations should offer something, and I think many are trying as you mentioned, you know, woman localization and you mentioned ATA who had these individual programs, which are terrific. But there are also outreach programs to academia. You know, ATA has an academic outreach program where people go into schools and talk to students about careers and in translation and interpreting and localization language services at large to start planting the seed in people’s brains that there are careers to be had. You know, ALC Bridge exists, the ALC program, which is to connect academia and industry and students with jobs, to be this clearinghouse of information about opportunities and translation and interpreting services. Elia Exchange, a European Language Industry Association, is a program that’s focused on outreach to academia. So, I think there are a lot of programs out there because businesses were finally starting to again, as I said, to take responsibility for this gap that we see. We’re starting to take a more active role in helping to train people. So ALC Bridge has a program where we’ll send speakers into classrooms to talk to students about jobs, careers and in ELIA Exchange does the same type of thing. We’re looking for opportunities with companies with member companies of these organizations to provide internships to students who might be interested and posting those opportunities in place that is clear.

 

So, associations can do a lot, you know, not only through their membership and offering opportunities to their members to become mentors or mentees, but also to be a place where people that are interested in the industry can go to find information on like, you’ve asked a question earlier on, where do you go to find a mentor? Well, like if you’re new to the industry and you don’t really have maybe you’re not in an academic program and you want to try to look somewhere to find out how you can start this career or the training that you need or just to get a sense of what it’s like, the easiest place to go is to an industry organization to at least point you in the right direction. So, I think industry associations have the role and the responsibility to be at least clearing houses for this information where people can go to find what they need to then go out and to meet new people and give opportunities for new people coming into the industry with interest in the industry to meet people who are practitioners already or to figure out what they need to do to get trained. You know, an association can do a lot more than an individual can do on that level.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Steve, how can companies benefit from mentorship activities? I mean, LLCs like yours and ours here. Is there an inherent corporate objective that can be accomplished from investing into mentorship? Can we encourage our team members to be involved more in mentorship and help other colleagues in the industry, whether they’re new or they’re just changing professions coming from outside the industry and learning about what we do here?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think the value of mentorship is, as I said before, the giving back part of the industry, which is I think all professions need to do. But I think that part of it, too, is if you have a mentor or individuals in your organization are doing mentoring, if you’ve got staff members who are interested in being mentors, that’s good experience for them working with other people. It helps them build people skills and management skills and also to see what others are doing in the industry outside of your organization, but also, a mentorship or an internship can ultimately turn into, if you train somebody up through an internship or if or you or through a mentorship, you meet somebody who has skills that you need inside your organization. That’s a good way to bring on new staff. So, it’s not completely altruistic, to provide mentorship. I think mentors get a lot out of it and leaders in companies that Mentor themselves bring notice to their own companies by doing their work and volunteering, but also it allows you to see other people out there in the world who are looking for work and are looking to connect that ultimately might turn into employees for your company one day.

 

And the same is true, obviously, with interns. Internships are typically a little bit more rigorous than a mentorship, but not necessarily so. But an internship could easily turn into a job for somebody which is which benefits a business. And the same is true going into a classroom and teaching at a university setting where you’re meeting people who are eager to enter the profession. And you might find somebody in your student body who ultimately is a good fit for you and your company. So, I think there’s a lot that a company can benefit other than just making sure that the people that come into the industry are prepared and are following best practices and are upholding standards of practice and ethics and things like that, but also this possibility that they might come to work for you.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Steve, learning is a lifelong experience. We all have to learn every single day. How can mentorship present learning opportunities for mentors themselves like you and me?

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think, as I said before, just the new perspective. I mean, if you do this long enough, you’ve done things a lot, in a certain way that that’s been successful for you and you get I won’t call it a rut, but you get used to doing things a certain way. And it’s as a mentor, working with people with fresh ideas and different perspectives can only be good, I think, it makes you rethink things. It might make you say, well, maybe this isn’t the best way anymore. Maybe if I use this tool or this technology, I could enhance doing these things. And these are things that you don’t necessarily learn on your own unless you’re looking for it. But again, just like I have said, the mentees, don’t know what they don’t know. Somebody like myself who’s been working in the industry for so long, there are a lot of things that I’m not exposed to because I’ve been working in a certain sector, or I’ve been working in a certain way. And it’s just like when you bring in new staff, new and younger staff to your organization, it’s the same people with outside perspectives, people who have come from other organizations refresh that it either can help confirm things that you’ve been doing in a certain way, or it can help you think about doing things in a different way. And I think that this mentorship from a mentor perspective keeps your ideas fresh. And I think it helps you keep the pulse of what’s happening in the industry and just life in general.

 

Again, I keep coming back to technology because I’m so old school and technology is not how I was trained. But every day somebody tells me about a new piece of technology that could help me do something better. And as I said, if a piece of technology can help me do something more effectively and efficiently, that then leaves me headspace to do creative things that I need to get done that I can only do with my human brain, then why not? And it’s only from talking to people about that and seeing how it works and seeing how it can be applied that you really learn. Reading about it isn’t enough, right? You need, me anyway; I need to see real-life applications of things. And technology, when you’re talking to younger people, people coming in, it just comes up naturally. It’s just part of how they operate, part of their DNA, right? Of course, they use technology. And somebody from my generation, that’s not the first thing that we think of, right? A younger person is going to think of how technology can help them get this job done. Sometimes I like that, sometimes I don’t. But, you don’t know it until somebody talks to you about it. So, I think that that’s a huge plus as a mentor.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

How should our industry think about mentorship going forward? Do you think we need to discuss this topic in more detail? I mean, we have a lot of forums where we talk about everything related to the industry, but mentorship doesn’t get a lot of coverage.

 

Stephen Lank

Well, I think that it doesn’t get a lot of coverage. You know, it’s so funny, translation and interpreting, they always say, if you can tell something is a translation, or if you notice the interpreter or the interpretation, then you’re doing your job wrong. In other words, we should all blend into the background. And I think that we’ve taken that too much to heart to the extent that we don’t even toot our own horns, within the industry itself to try to draw more people in. So, I think that we do need to talk about it more. We do need to talk about mentorship, we do need to talk about the responsibility, we need to talk about mentorship and training as a responsibility of companies, and veterans, long-time practitioners, and not just something that they could do, or might be nice if they did. We owe it to the industry, and to ourselves to ensure that people coming in are trained and prepared. And academia can’t do that by themselves. So, we need to take some responsibility.

 

And I think we finally are starting to. For a long time, we have complained about this lack of talent. Well, it’s not a lack of talent. It’s a lack of training. There are people out there who want to do the work and who have the language skills to do the work, but they haven’t been trained enough in the business aspects of it, or the project management aspects of it, or in our processes and procedures in our companies. And you cannot expect somebody to come out of an academic program fully formed. And I think that, as I said before, we’ve been putting too much pressure on academia to do that for us. And we need to finally step up and say, we need to help with this. It’s our responsibility, too. We’re not going to get what we need unless we engage. And the best way to do that is through teaching and mentorship, I think.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

As we reach the end of this interview, I mean, this dialogue will continue, but today, can you please share a few words of advice to leadership and LSPs, colleagues in the industry in general, or even folks in localization management roles or on the buyer side? What would you recommend they should do to improve mentorship in our industry?

 

Stephen Lank

I think the thing that everybody can do to improve mentorship in our industry is to become a mentor themselves. Put aside the time, volunteer your time, and offer it to people. And a lot of times, I think people don’t think that they necessarily have anything to offer. Maybe it’s too much pressure to think of yourself as a mentor, but it is invaluable for a new person coming into the industry to have the ear of somebody and the support of somebody who’s got experience, who’s been working in the industry. And you might think that your day-to-day isn’t anything that’s particularly earth-shattering or earth-moving, but you do know your industry, you know your job. These people coming in don’t know that yet. So, everything that you have to share is a value. I still call people and ask for help with things. People that I’ve met through the industry, you know, 35 years on, I don’t know everything, and I have particular people that I call if I have a technology question or if a new service is being offered that I’m not really familiar with and how do I do this? And so, you just have to be open.

 

So, we all like to talk about what we do, I think. But I think we need to offer that explicitly to people to help them. So, you go to your local university and offer to talk to a program. Maybe they have a T&I program internally and talk to them about careers or about your own career. People love to hear about people who are interested in the industry, love to hear about what brought you into the industry or what was your trajectory through the industry, all these different things. I mean, people are fascinated by that and just offering to go in to talk to a program or even if there’s not a program, maybe you’ve got a local high school that has a world language program or a local community college or even a university. They don’t have a T&I program, but they have a world languages program. Offer to go in and speak to them, to students about careers, you know what they can do with their language. I think that in the US right now, as I said at the beginning of this podcast, we have a need for language services in this country right now.

 

The language that education in the US doesn’t address necessarily, is the language of immigration. I do a lot of work in languages of Southeast Asia and East Africa and from all over. And so, you have a lot of heritage speakers in the US who, maybe they probably have been doing translation and interpreting for their families informally while they’ve been here since they’ve gotten here to help the families engage and to get settled in the country and don’t but don’t see it as a career themselves. We need to go and speak to those individuals at the high school level to let them know what it is that they can do and how you’ve been doing this work casually. Maybe you see your language as a burden, but it’s not a burden. It’s something that you can make a career out of. And maybe you should consider that. And I think that people don’t know what they don’t know. And we need to do a better job of letting the world know, letting students know what is possible with language and the careers that are available. And so, we need to take that upon ourselves.

 

I would tell leaders in this industry, whether you’re running a company or you’re an individual translator or interpreter yourself to actively engage with students to encourage them to enter the field, enter the profession and offer your help. So that they can do that. I think we owe it to them, and we owe it to ourselves. And we can’t just sit back and let somebody else do it for us. We need to do that for ourselves.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

That was a very interesting conversation. And Steve, people who are new to the industry are looking for ways to learn about new areas of this industry. I’m sure they will find your insights and perspective extremely helpful. I think we should all do our part. And I agree with you that we should offer our expertise as mentoring opportunities for colleagues looking to grow in their careers. And with that, I thank you for your time and for sharing your experience with me today.

 

Stephen Lank

Thank you so much. I appreciate the opportunity to talk about this. I love this topic and I love that you were open to discussing it. Thanks very much for this.

 

Sultan Ghaznawi

Okay, it’s time for my roundup of the interview and my analysis as to what has been discussed. The translation and localization industry has evolved and grown both in size and in scope. New people constantly join this industry either as first career or have somehow ended in this industry due to their jobs. Seasoned industry veterans that have learned different aspects of this industry have an obligation to transfer their knowledge to colleagues who may find it challenging to look for information or do not have an opportunity to gain hands-on or on-the-job experience. At the end of the day, our industry is only as good as the people working in it. And now it is our time to make sure a translation and localization workforce is well-equipped as in any other industry.

 

That brings us to the end of this episode. Please share your thoughts and comments and suggest ideas or guests that you may want to hear from. As I always say, even if 1% benefited from today’s conversation, then my goal is met.

Don’t forget to subscribe to the Translation Company Talk Podcast on Apple Podcasts, iTunes, Google Podcasts, Spotify, or your platform of choice and give us a 5-star rating for this episode.

 

Until next time!

 

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